Talk:Biology/Related Articles

Currently, this subpage definitely needs improvement. --Larry Sanger 00:18, 7 July 2007 (CDT)

Subfields table/template

There is a "General subfields within biology" that I simply moved from the bottom of the Biology page here. I think that by regularizing the location of internal links--including links to articles about subfields--by putting them on "Related Links" pages, this sort of table/template is going to be redundant. If you want to know what the subfields are, you'll always know to look under "related."

Basically, I've always had a bit of a problem with such tables on Wikipedia. (Adding them was a practice that started after I left, so don't blame me.) The links listed are, as they are here in the "Subdisciplines" section, completely redundant. --Larry Sanger 22:59, 6 July 2007 (CDT)

Other related topics table

Chris, the table is impressive, but I have a worry about it, namely, that so much formatting is going to make some people wary of editing it, and will perhaps make other people less likely to work on the "related" page simply because they think they'll have to know how to work complicated tables.

So I'm inclined to say we should remove the tabular form and simply list the links. --Larry Sanger 22:59, 6 July 2007 (CDT)

Should links be annotated?

I very much like the brief annotations of links. I think such annotations will really help the end user. Some links, however, will probably be used over and over again on these "related" pages. We don't want to type those annotations over and over again.

So I wonder if it wouldn't make sense, instead, for us to add yet another subpage type for all articles: a one-sentence definition. I'll create a few examples.

I actually think it will be a nice "in"--we'll get our foot in the door, the camel's nose in the tent, get people thinking about a mere definition, and they'll build out the entire wiki in advance of full articles. And I think this will probably be an excellent thing.

What do you think? Will this be useful? --Larry Sanger 22:59, 6 July 2007 (CDT)

Lines through the subpage template

Note the lines through the subpage template here. Anybody know a way to fix that? --Larry Sanger 23:02, 6 July 2007 (CDT)

Definitions???

OK, here's how I've set it up.

1. In the wiki markup, I replaced the definition of "biochemistry" in the list of subdisciplines with {{def Biochemistry}} (and that template reads, precisely: "Template:Def Biochemistry"). I propose that we replace all definitions that appear on the Related Articles pages with such templates; that way, we can use and reuse the same definitions at will, at the very least on Related Articles pages, if not elsewhere.
2. Next, I created Biology/Definition, the entire contents of which is "{{defpage}}". I propose that all definition pages will be the same; they will provide a very simplistic and consistent setting for the contents of the {{def Title}} template.
3. I added a link to the definition page at the top of the {{subpages}} template. Hence, we'd soon have a definition/description, very brief, about every topic on which we have articles (that use subpage templates). The first thing people will jump to fill out will be the definition.
4. Note some interesting consequences!
   • People might be motivated to create definitions for topics about which there are no articles.
   • Creating a definition and then a defpage (like Biochemistry/Definition) provides a jumping-off point for all other kinds of content. Whee!
   • Hence, we might want to encourage this defining behavior, because it would help build out the wiki.
   • Note, it wouldn't increase (and therefore trivialize) our article count.

One technical problem I've got to solve, though, is how to navigate easily from a Related Articles page to the definition (not the article) as it appears...well, that's easily licked. You'll see... --Larry Sanger 23:50, 6 July 2007 (CDT)

Further notes:

1. Created a {{R}} (for "related") template. This simply takes an article title name and prints out a line suitable for the Related Articles page, complete with bullet point.
2. Note, if you use the {{R}} template and the definition doesn't exist, it spits out two small-font links: "d" and "e". The "d" link takes you to the definition page for that topic (e.g., I just created Biogeography/Definition by following the "d" link). The "e" link takes you to the template page.
3. The functionality of this template means you don't need to know that definitions live on {{def TopicName}}-format pages. All you need to know is: add a line of the format "{{r|ArticleName}}" (nothing more); save; press the "e" link that was created, and write a definition; press the "d" link, and simply type "{{defpage}}". Done!
4. Then not only have you created an entry on this Related Articles page, you have also created the aforementioned jumping-off platform for a new article (and a whole "infoset") about TopicName.
5. Note also, the functionality of this template very cleverly requires that you write definitions for links!

Can you see now how people would just go to town building out the related pages? Thus finding homes for all those poor orphans? And more importantly, get excited about writing an article about such-and-such, simply because they've written a definition? --Larry Sanger 00:08, 7 July 2007 (CDT)

How to improve this page

There are many possible ways to improve this list of internal links.

• Check the subdiscipline list for exhaustiveness. This is precisely where we ought to list subdisciplines exhaustively.
• Add other parent topics? Need to give that some thought, on the very idea of a "parent topic."
• Possibly, move more subsections from "other related topics" to "subtopics." We may tentatively define "subtopic" as follows:

  x is a subtopic of y =df. discussion of x itself is necessarily also discussion of y. Example: bacteria are a subtopic of biology.

• But notice that there are many subtopics that are too specialized. Hence, a subtopic list should not be exhaustive. It should include the most important subtopics, as well as all of the immediate subtopics, of a given topic. This calls for another definition:

  x is an immediate subtopic of y =df. x is a subtopic of y, and there is no other topic, z, of which we can say that x is a subtopic of z, and z is a subtopic of y. Example: life is an immediate subtopic of biology.

• The total number of links can be increased.
• We can think creatively about other categories of internal links--especially categories of links that our readers might find interesting and useful. For example, zoo animals. But we might not want to have that list here; we might want to have it under Zoology/Related or Animal/Related.

More later, probably. --Larry Sanger 11:43, 7 July 2007 (CDT)