Talk:Cost of nuclear power

Nuclear is too expensive

This discussion has been moved to the Debate Guide page.

Use of the word "currently", and similar words,, is no good

Articles should not reference present tense in citing things like costs in the marketplace. Instead, please use month and year, with phrasing such as: "In June 2024, uranium was trading at $110." Pat Palmer (talk) 05:04, 6 June 2024 (CDT)

Good catch. I'll get the correct date, fix this article, and pay attention to this problem in the future. David MacQuigg (talk) 08:56, 6 June 2024 (CDT)

Yesterday I uploaded a new version of Figure 2, but the article still has the old version. David MacQuigg (talk) 10:08, 7 June 2024 (CDT)

Yellowcake Uranium

Hi David - Did a quick readthrough of this article. Somewhere it said Uranium was sold as Yellowcake? I don't have a clue what that really means. In the whole section about the cost of reactor fuels, I am unable to understand things. What does it mean to say something only uses 5%? What has to happen to Yellowcake uranium to prepare it for use in each kind of reactor? I realize this is a very complex, tough topic--and I feel we aren't there yet in terms of explaining it to smart lay readers. Also, the figure about comparative costs of building reactors in the different countries talks about "the regulatory environment"; that could use some explaining, and a specific example would be helpful, such as "In the U.S., (such and so has to happen), but in (other countries such as ? which are not regulated by ?, they can just (blah blah)." Even though it may be costly, I assume regulation is more of a good thing that a bad thing--but, I'm not sure. Pat Palmer (talk) 13:10, 7 June 2024 (CDT)

Hi Pat - I fixed the "yellowcake" by adding a link to Wikipedia and removing the chemical formula U3O8. I've also added a footnote explaining how I got the 0.5% for the overall fuel efficiency of Light Water Reactors. As for the cost of unnecessary regulation, this is a major topic of debate, and we probably should make it a separate article. Jack Devanney is the expert on this. Regulation of any dangerous industry is a necessary thing, but the complaint is that nuclear regulation has been abused by anti-nukers to put it out of business. Let's put this on our ToDo list. Meanwhile, we can let Figure 1 speak for itself. David MacQuigg (talk) 18:54, 8 June 2024 (CDT)

We can also add links to Devanney's articles on our Debate page under the heading == Nuclear is too expensive ==. He has a collection of Substack articles on Cost of Nuclear Power. One of them - How Can NRC-Style Regulation be so Expensive is right on point. David MacQuigg (talk) 10:17, 9 June 2024 (CDT)

Hidden costs of wind and solar

It seems to me that I do not know whether the solar cost estimates include anything about waste disposal after the life of panels; my understanding is that, 1) it takes a significant amount of energy to manufacture the panels (and mining of various materials, which like fossil fuels may be finite), and 2) the panels, when disposed of in a land fill, may contain heavy metals that could later leach into the environment, and materials that are not biodegradable. Similarly, is the cost of maintaining windmills (which, after all, include lots of moving parts) being factored in? Also, is it acceptable that the windmills kill off birds which may already be environmentally endangered? I am asking the hard questions here. Maybe they could lead to some footnotes. And BTW, although the syntax is a bit funky, I've learned to add actual "Notes" at the bottom, as opposed to "References", and can show you how if that should prove useful. Thanks for working on this! Pat Palmer (talk) 13:10, 7 June 2024 (CDT)

My best source on total lifecycle costs is Dr. Hesthammer's website. I believe he is including all mining and manufacturing costs, but possibly not disposal costs. I haven't looked into this, but my common sense is that worries about landfills are overblown. Solar panels are mostly aluminum and glass and thin slices of silicon, doped with miniscule amounts of hazardous elements, nothing compared to what is going into our landfills now. On the windmills, I would be surprised if he didn't include an obvious cost like maintenance. I'm not sure about the birds. I've been told that cats kill far more birds than windmills, but then someone countered with - windmills kill eagles. I've heard they also kill whales, but that may be paranoia. I'm happy to separate the Notes from the References, if you think there is some advantage. David MacQuigg (talk)

`